Many days ago when I was sick and tired of being sick and tired; I was invited to an AA meeting by a close friend. At that meeting I learned that I was an Alcoholic, and that I needed to change what I was doing and who I was doing it with.
In two months, I had attened over 90 meetings, replaced my former friends with real friends, and got married to the best woman I ever met. I basicly changed my entire life during my first two months sober. My life has continued to improve ever since, and I have no desire to go back to drinking.
I know that this type of changes are not recommended in THE BIG BOOK, but it got me sober.
I now have a life I enjoy living with real friends and a family of my own.
I really want to thank all the AA people that have helped me in the may ways over the years.
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AA for all?
Discussion started by kevin smith , on Friday, 22 May 2009 23:22
I'm new to this whole thing,but anyway,does aa really work for everybody?People following the steps,some of the steps just don't seem right to me.And the meeting,while you try to stop thinking of it,it's all they talk about!I really think steps 8 and 9 are a little much for most people to accept.I've been to four rehabs,countless meeting,(mandated),and some of the people teaching these classes ain't ever been an alcoholic.As you all know,you can't teach what you don't know! I sure hope it works for any of you!
Latest Discussion
Hi All,
Note: I did not say that what anyone else was doing in sobriety was wrong. I referred to myself ONLY! I prefaced some my comments with "For Me" If you wish to say you are recovered I don't have a probelm with that. Bottom line is that you are sober and I am sober and we both follow the program to the best of our abilities and understanding. I know that my understanding of alcoholism, recovery, and the program, are vastly different from when I first sobered up in 1984. Or when I was 5 - 10 - 15 - or 20 years sober. My sobriety is constantly evolving and maturing. I dare say that none of us see, experience, and practice sobriety the same as we did say, at a year sober.
Your last line in your post says it all, Mark. "Surely - I have a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of my Spiritual Condition . . . . . "
Isn't that all we really have? Today?
There is an old Chinese proverb that goes.... "There are many paths up the mountain, each of us taking a different path. But once upon the summit, do we all not gaze upon the same moon?
So let's not get into a big hairy taffy pull here.
Pax?
Note: I did not say that what anyone else was doing in sobriety was wrong. I referred to myself ONLY! I prefaced some my comments with "For Me" If you wish to say you are recovered I don't have a probelm with that. Bottom line is that you are sober and I am sober and we both follow the program to the best of our abilities and understanding. I know that my understanding of alcoholism, recovery, and the program, are vastly different from when I first sobered up in 1984. Or when I was 5 - 10 - 15 - or 20 years sober. My sobriety is constantly evolving and maturing. I dare say that none of us see, experience, and practice sobriety the same as we did say, at a year sober.
Your last line in your post says it all, Mark. "Surely - I have a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of my Spiritual Condition . . . . . "
Isn't that all we really have? Today?
There is an old Chinese proverb that goes.... "There are many paths up the mountain, each of us taking a different path. But once upon the summit, do we all not gaze upon the same moon?
So let's not get into a big hairy taffy pull here.
Pax?
647 days ago
Mark,
Hi Billl1,
I’m not sure if you do what it sAAys we do . . . It’s the only wAAy I cAAn stAAy sober!
I have recovered - Thank God!
Title Page - “Alcoholics Anonymous The story of how many thousands of men and women have recovered from Alcoholism.” (For me – The Very Definition of Alcoholics Anonymous.)
17:1 “We, of ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS, know thousands of men and women who were once just as hopeless as Bill. Nearly all have recovered. They have solved the drink problem.”
20:1 “Doubtless you are curious to discover how and why, in the face of expert opinion to the contrary, we have recovered from a hopeless condition of mind and body.”
29:1 “Further on, clear-cut directions are given showing how we recovered.”
90:3 “If he says yes, then his attention should be drawn to you as a person who has recovered.”
96:1 “He often says that if he had continued to work on them, he might have deprived many others, who have since recovered, of their chance.”
113:1 “He knows that thousands of men, much like himself, have recovered.”
132:2 “We have recovered, and have been given the power to help others.”
133:1 “We, who have recovered from serious drinking, are miracles of mental health.”
146:2 “An alcoholic who has recovered, but holds a relatively unimportant job, can talk to a man with a better position.”
Not to mention the numerous times it refers to recover!
Surely - I have a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of my Spiritual Condition . . . . .
I’m not sure if you do what it sAAys we do . . . It’s the only wAAy I cAAn stAAy sober!
I have recovered - Thank God!
Title Page - “Alcoholics Anonymous The story of how many thousands of men and women have recovered from Alcoholism.” (For me – The Very Definition of Alcoholics Anonymous.)
17:1 “We, of ALCOHOLICS ANONYMOUS, know thousands of men and women who were once just as hopeless as Bill. Nearly all have recovered. They have solved the drink problem.”
20:1 “Doubtless you are curious to discover how and why, in the face of expert opinion to the contrary, we have recovered from a hopeless condition of mind and body.”
29:1 “Further on, clear-cut directions are given showing how we recovered.”
90:3 “If he says yes, then his attention should be drawn to you as a person who has recovered.”
96:1 “He often says that if he had continued to work on them, he might have deprived many others, who have since recovered, of their chance.”
113:1 “He knows that thousands of men, much like himself, have recovered.”
132:2 “We have recovered, and have been given the power to help others.”
133:1 “We, who have recovered from serious drinking, are miracles of mental health.”
146:2 “An alcoholic who has recovered, but holds a relatively unimportant job, can talk to a man with a better position.”
Not to mention the numerous times it refers to recover!
Surely - I have a daily reprieve contingent on the maintenance of my Spiritual Condition . . . . .
647 days ago
I was about six months sober back between Thanksgiving and Christmas 1984, when two of the old mossbacks from our group were arguing which was better.... sobering up in a treatment center, or the "Old Way". Doc Harvey and Guy had a three quarters of a cenury agregate sobriety between them. Generally when they spoke we listened. They argued for about and hour after the meeting in the "half measures" lounge while sippin' coffee and holding the attention of those of us that followed this debate between a couple of our wizend oracles from wino mountain. When the smoke cleared, they had come to a consensus that it didn't matter how we sobered up as long as we did.
A couple of months later came round two. Is AA the only way to sober up. Doc Harvey took the position that there were other means of achieving and maintaining sobriety. Guy was a consumate Big Book thumper and no one could stay sober without AA. They went round and round for almost three hours that Sunday afternoon. Again, they came to a consensus that as long as the basic priciples of a desire to stop drinking, admit there was a problem, come to believe in something greater than self, commit ourselves to that higher power, clean house, make amends, maintain vigilent awareness of self and our actions correcting our transgressions when needed, and give back (service work), the method didn't matter.
Now all of that imparted wisdom spun around in my head for the next eighteen months. I tried to do it all at once until I was about two degrees this side of nuts when the miracle happened. I was graced by the opportunity to hear Dr. Bob's son, "Smitty", speak here in Austin. I was a few days shy of my second AA anniversary. He spoke for almost two hours with a short intermission. Starting with his recollections of living with his father when he drank, then witnessing the birth of AA, giving the back story to the how and the why the steps and traditions were created. Somewhere during the process something tuned on the lights in my head and all that stuff that was spinning around came to a screeching halt. It all made sense. I got it.
I then came to the realization that no amount of steps, traditions, literature, or meetings could keep me sober if I did not WANT to stay sober. But as long as I wanted to stay sober the steps, the traditions AND the fellowship were what I needed to do so. The steps and tradfitions for the nuts and bolts of sobriety and the fellowship for a true reflection of my progress.
The AA program works. But it only works as long as I want it to work. As long as I am willing to do whatever it takes to acheive and maintain my sobriety. That can be said of any recovery program, twelve step or otherwise.
So for me, it boils down to this..... As long as I am more afraid of living drunk, than of living sober by living life on life's terms, I will maintain my sobriety be ANY means at my disposal. When or IF I lose that healthy fear of returning to the life I had while I was drunk, I will drink again. Know that everything that had happened to me when I was trunk, happened in sobriety. Death of loved ones, financial ruin, Illness, and so on. and so on, I won't bore you with the laundry list. And by living the principles of what I have learned within that little Big Book, and other sober alcoholics, I am secure in the fact that as long as I don't take a drink, it will always get better after it gets worse.
For me, there is no such thing as being "Recovered" for that implies my growth, my continued effort to maintain my sobiety has ceased. I have learned that for me, I don't just work the steps and traditions to stay sober. I have to live them daily, put their principles in practice on a daily basis, and then give them away to someone else on a daily basis by the way I live my life. Otherwise, I'm just one drink away from a drunk.
A couple of months later came round two. Is AA the only way to sober up. Doc Harvey took the position that there were other means of achieving and maintaining sobriety. Guy was a consumate Big Book thumper and no one could stay sober without AA. They went round and round for almost three hours that Sunday afternoon. Again, they came to a consensus that as long as the basic priciples of a desire to stop drinking, admit there was a problem, come to believe in something greater than self, commit ourselves to that higher power, clean house, make amends, maintain vigilent awareness of self and our actions correcting our transgressions when needed, and give back (service work), the method didn't matter.
Now all of that imparted wisdom spun around in my head for the next eighteen months. I tried to do it all at once until I was about two degrees this side of nuts when the miracle happened. I was graced by the opportunity to hear Dr. Bob's son, "Smitty", speak here in Austin. I was a few days shy of my second AA anniversary. He spoke for almost two hours with a short intermission. Starting with his recollections of living with his father when he drank, then witnessing the birth of AA, giving the back story to the how and the why the steps and traditions were created. Somewhere during the process something tuned on the lights in my head and all that stuff that was spinning around came to a screeching halt. It all made sense. I got it.
I then came to the realization that no amount of steps, traditions, literature, or meetings could keep me sober if I did not WANT to stay sober. But as long as I wanted to stay sober the steps, the traditions AND the fellowship were what I needed to do so. The steps and tradfitions for the nuts and bolts of sobriety and the fellowship for a true reflection of my progress.
The AA program works. But it only works as long as I want it to work. As long as I am willing to do whatever it takes to acheive and maintain my sobriety. That can be said of any recovery program, twelve step or otherwise.
So for me, it boils down to this..... As long as I am more afraid of living drunk, than of living sober by living life on life's terms, I will maintain my sobriety be ANY means at my disposal. When or IF I lose that healthy fear of returning to the life I had while I was drunk, I will drink again. Know that everything that had happened to me when I was trunk, happened in sobriety. Death of loved ones, financial ruin, Illness, and so on. and so on, I won't bore you with the laundry list. And by living the principles of what I have learned within that little Big Book, and other sober alcoholics, I am secure in the fact that as long as I don't take a drink, it will always get better after it gets worse.
For me, there is no such thing as being "Recovered" for that implies my growth, my continued effort to maintain my sobiety has ceased. I have learned that for me, I don't just work the steps and traditions to stay sober. I have to live them daily, put their principles in practice on a daily basis, and then give them away to someone else on a daily basis by the way I live my life. Otherwise, I'm just one drink away from a drunk.
647 days ago
Interesting discussion! Being a "recovered alcoholic", I am in agreement with Mark's comments above. The problem is that many (Hmmm most) try going to meetings every day and when that doesn't work, they claim to have tried A.A. to no avail. Going to A.A. meetings, however, is not "trying A.A."! Many believe that the words "fellowship" and "program" are interchageable synonyms when in fact, nothing could be further from the truth. I often hear people ask each other how long they've been "in the program" when what they really mean to ask is how long they've been "in the fellowship". We've all heard that over used phrase; "Don't Drink and Go To Meetings" but that's not the A.A. Program. As Mark stated earlier, the A.A. Program is found in the first 164 pages of A.A.'s basic textbook, Alcoholics Anonymous" (Big Book). It contains clear-cut directions that show us precisely how to recover from alcoholism.
In "How It Works" which we read at almost every meeting, every day, around the world, we read; "Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thouroughly followed our path." What is the path? The path is the process of recovery set out in the Big Book. So unless you have precisely followed those clear-cut directions contained in the first part of the Big Book and are counted among the "rarelies", please don't say that you've tried the A.A. Program and it didn't work! The Promises including being recovered comes as a result of following the A.A. Program. Coffee and friendships are the only promises the A.A. Fellowship can make. If you tried going to A.A. meetings and that didn't work for you, please don't equate that experience with trying the A.A. Program!
Yvon P.
In "How It Works" which we read at almost every meeting, every day, around the world, we read; "Rarely have we seen a person fail who has thouroughly followed our path." What is the path? The path is the process of recovery set out in the Big Book. So unless you have precisely followed those clear-cut directions contained in the first part of the Big Book and are counted among the "rarelies", please don't say that you've tried the A.A. Program and it didn't work! The Promises including being recovered comes as a result of following the A.A. Program. Coffee and friendships are the only promises the A.A. Fellowship can make. If you tried going to A.A. meetings and that didn't work for you, please don't equate that experience with trying the A.A. Program!
Yvon P.
1337 days ago
KSMITH I THOUGHT AS YOU DID FOR TEN YEAS. I STAYED SOBER BUT DIDN'T DO ALL THE STEPS, NOR MAKE MEETINGS. SPONSOR I DIDN'T NEED ONE.
BUT ALL THAT CHANGED AND I FOUND A HAPPIER LIFE WHEN I FINALLY DID WHAT THE FIRST 164 PAGES DIRECTED ME TO DO. IT SAVED MY LIFE.
JUST BEFORE MY 18TH AA BIRTHDAY I ALMOST DIED. I WAS SO ANGRY AND SO SICK THAT I HAD GIVEN UP. MY SYSTEMS WERE SHUTTING DOWN FAST AND THEN THE VOICE OF AA SPOKE TO ME. BOTTOM LINE I HEARD THAT MY RAGE WAS EQUAL TO THE SEPTIC IN MY SYSTEM.
I TAUGHT MYSELF TO WALK AGAIN, I TOOK CHARGE OF MY TREATMENT AND I BEGAN TO EAT AGAIN. IT TOOK ME 3 WEEKS BUT I GOT OUT OF THAT HOSPITAL AND WHEN I WAS STRONGER TO A MEETING. I NOW STAY INSTEAD OF FLITTING IN AND OUT!!
DOES AA WORK...YES!!! DO THE STEPS WORK ...YES!!!
BUT ALL THAT CHANGED AND I FOUND A HAPPIER LIFE WHEN I FINALLY DID WHAT THE FIRST 164 PAGES DIRECTED ME TO DO. IT SAVED MY LIFE.
JUST BEFORE MY 18TH AA BIRTHDAY I ALMOST DIED. I WAS SO ANGRY AND SO SICK THAT I HAD GIVEN UP. MY SYSTEMS WERE SHUTTING DOWN FAST AND THEN THE VOICE OF AA SPOKE TO ME. BOTTOM LINE I HEARD THAT MY RAGE WAS EQUAL TO THE SEPTIC IN MY SYSTEM.
I TAUGHT MYSELF TO WALK AGAIN, I TOOK CHARGE OF MY TREATMENT AND I BEGAN TO EAT AGAIN. IT TOOK ME 3 WEEKS BUT I GOT OUT OF THAT HOSPITAL AND WHEN I WAS STRONGER TO A MEETING. I NOW STAY INSTEAD OF FLITTING IN AND OUT!!
DOES AA WORK...YES!!! DO THE STEPS WORK ...YES!!!
1437 days ago
AA works when the person work's it and THE continues to PRACTICE it. AA is not something i joined nor graduate from , AA is something i TRY to LIVE to the best of my ability ODAAT. That bein said if booze is causin anyone prblms there is NO WRONG way to stay sober, someways are more fun then other's.
1451 days ago
AA doesn't work for all people. The people that it works for are those that have a desire to stop drinking.
1451 days ago
Mark,
My name is Mark . . . and I'm a Recovered Alcoholic,
If you do precisely what it the 164 pages sAAy we do, you have a 75% chance of recovering. When AA began, half of the drunks came and stayed sober forever. Another 25% "went out", came back and stayed sober forever.
Pretty good odds . . . especially when you consider the dismal 1%, or whatever other methods are getting.
Doing what they did has kept me sober for over nine years, and I hAAve no doubt it will continue to work.
If you do precisely what it the 164 pages sAAy we do, you have a 75% chance of recovering. When AA began, half of the drunks came and stayed sober forever. Another 25% "went out", came back and stayed sober forever.
Pretty good odds . . . especially when you consider the dismal 1%, or whatever other methods are getting.
Doing what they did has kept me sober for over nine years, and I hAAve no doubt it will continue to work.
1456 days ago
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